502 Generator spring removal

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renaissanceman
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502 Generator spring removal

#1

Post by renaissanceman »

All, long time lurker working on a rebuild of a 502 that has never been apart. It's been in the family for a couple generations, and has always worked relatively well, but started having trouble lighting without heating the generator with a torch before opening the valve. I figured it was time for a refresh. I'm waiting on the oil filter wrench coming to my NAPA on Monday to get the burner plate off, so it's currently got some Kroil working on the threads. The tank is de-rusting with the vinegar/salt solution.

I disassembled the generator and it had decades worth of carbon on the rod. The spring is firmly stuck. I'm used to working on the multi-burner stoves and the springs usually push free pretty easily on those. This one is very stuck. I used my ultrasonic cleaner on it for about an hour with no luck and I've currently got Kroil working on it as well. Any tips or tricks?
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25_502s
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#2

Post by 25_502s »

Maybe torch it and dunk in water??
Last edited by 25_502s on Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Hot_Diggity
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#3

Post by Hot_Diggity »

What Jason said. Heat and quench, heat and quench. Repeat as necessary. Just put a little pressure on the spring each time and see if it'll start moving. Don't rush it. It will move with the right number of heat/quench cycles.
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#4

Post by Tgarner01 »

25_502s wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 12:00 am Maybe torch can t and dunk in water??
+1
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outlawmws
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#5

Post by outlawmws »

Yep, several heatings with a torch (very hot, but don't melt it - edging to a glow...) and quenchings will usually dislodge the worst; THEN use the US tank...
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Mister_Wilson
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#6

Post by Mister_Wilson »

Be careful when you try to unscrew the burner bowl. Don't bend the Bunsen. Those two parts can become very fond of each other.
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mksmth
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#7

Post by mksmth »

i fought a 502 gen spring for long awhile. finally The heat and cold water made it come out. Then while cleaning it I got a bore brush stuck in the tube and it pissed me off so bad I just destroyed the tube and ordered a new one from OCP.
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renaissanceman
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#8

Post by renaissanceman »

I'll try the heat and quench on both the burner bowl and the generator when I get the wrench.
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#9

Post by renaissanceman »

So the generator came apart today with just a tiny bit of gentle propane torch heat:

Image

That'll probably cause some running issues...

The burner bowl won't budge, even after several days of soaking with penetrating oil and three heat quench cycles. I think I'm just going to let it be. I de-rusted the tank with it in place, and so there is no real need to remove it. I may sand some of the rust off and paint with the 2000F flat aluminum paint, but I'll probably just let it be with the rusty patina. The stove is not a show piece anyway.
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#10

Post by JimL »

The toughest burner bowl removal for me was in the winter, which worked to my advantage. It got a real quench when I pushed into the snow, but still took several tries. If it's running, run it a while until the burner bowl gets really hot and try removing it immediately after shutdown. Unlike a torch heating a little at a time, the whole bowl will be nice and hot.
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renaissanceman
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#11

Post by renaissanceman »

If it ends up running well after it gets put together it'll likely just stay frozen for another 4 or 5 decades. I'm feeling like I basically have nowhere to go but down on this one, I'll end up damaging something trying to get it apart for grins only. It's not like I actually have to disassemble for any real reason after she's up and running.
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Mister_Wilson
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#12

Post by Mister_Wilson »

Good attitude on the burner bowl, many a bowl and/or Bunsen has been damaged trying to separate them. If an honest effort doesn't do it, and it's not imperative, let it ride.
Just asking, does your generator tube have a bulge in it maybe 1/2" from the tip end? Kind of looks like it in your picture. If so, check for a crack, it happens. Hopefully just an illusion, I fall prey to those.
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#13

Post by zoomkat »

"It's not like I actually have to disassemble for any real reason after she's up and running."

I got the bowl in my dad's 502 *carefully* using a large pair of channel locks. That being said, might be best to leave it be until there is a real issue that requires removal.
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#14

Post by Cajuncook1 »

renaissanceman wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:43 pm If it ends up running well after it gets put together it'll likely just stay frozen for another 4 or 5 decades. I'm feeling like I basically have nowhere to go but down on this one, I'll end up damaging something trying to get it apart for grins only. It's not like I actually have to disassemble for any real reason after she's up and running.
I ran into the same issue with a parts 502 stove just recently. Could not get the bowel separated from the Bunsen after multiple multiple attempts from various suggestions.

I came to same conclusion as you did. After cleaning off the rust, cleaning out the tank, and cleaning the generator, refreshed the leather pump cup, and replace fuel tank cap gasket, it got put into service for a pot of coffee.

I have several other 502 stoves I recently purchased. I will get those properly serviced.

The ex parts stove will be a frequent user.

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renaissanceman
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#15

Post by renaissanceman »

Mister_Wilson wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:49 pm Good attitude on the burner bowl, many a bowl and/or Bunsen has been damaged trying to separate them. If an honest effort doesn't do it, and it's not imperative, let it ride.
Just asking, does your generator tube have a bulge in it maybe 1/2" from the tip end? Kind of looks like it in your picture. If so, check for a crack, it happens. Hopefully just an illusion, I fall prey to those.
Yes, it has a bulge, but no cracks.

I also just freed some type of screen from the end -- it was all balled up and when unfolded is square with a maybe 3/32" hole in the center. Is this needed or should I trash it? I've never encountered a screen in my other stove's generators...maybe because someone else has cleaned them and trashed it before me?
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Mister_Wilson
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#16

Post by Mister_Wilson »

You can discard the screen. They were used in the past to help filter particles that might be in the fuel. As long as you are starting with a cleaned generator and fount, and using filtered gas, there is no need for it.
Keep an eye on that bulge. It may eventually split.
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JimL
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#17

Post by JimL »

>>It's not like I actually have to disassemble for any real reason after she's up and running.

This is a very good point. On the one I quenched in the snow, it needed to come apart because the F/A tube was blocked enough that the stove wouldn't run. Several people here have ruined the burner bowl and/or bunsen as Mister Wilson stated. The indication is the WTB for those parts in the classifieds. :)
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Tgarner01
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#18

Post by Tgarner01 »

I've removed several of the frozen burner bowls on these 502s. What I find works the best is using a welding tip on an acetylene torch to pinpoint the heat on the bowl around the bunsen threads. Acetylene and oxygen heat much faster than propane which is what we want so the bunsen does not heat at the same rate as the bowl hence breaking the threads loose.

Funny thing is you'll grab a rusty 502 and think there's no way it's coming apart, and it'll spin apart by hand the next one looks new old stock and you have to get it cherry red.... Funny world we live in sometimes 😁
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renaissanceman
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#19

Post by renaissanceman »

The work resulted in a very hot stove. I never knew what a huge amount of heat a properly working 502 could generate.

Full power:

Image
Image
Image

And simmering:

Image

When rotating the cleaning rod to set to simmer, it will go out if the rod points straight down, which it didn't do before, but that's pretty minor. I rotated the generator so the bulge is upward to (hopefully) buy some time since the generators are discontinued. I feel like I should turn a stainless generator tube to replace the one I have at some point...
Cajuncook1
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#20

Post by Cajuncook1 »

OCP now has reproduction 502 generators for sale.

Cheers,

Cajuncook1
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#21

Post by Phredd »

NIce job getting that old 502 working!

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Gunhippie
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#22

Post by Gunhippie »

Well done!

If you find a need to remove the burner bowl at some point (spiderweb in the Bunsen is the usual reason), try heating and quenching using penetrating oil as the quench. Do this outside and expect some flames, but this trick has worked wonder for me over the years.
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#23

Post by zoomkat »

"If you find a need to remove the burner bowl at some point (spiderweb in the Bunsen is the usual reason), "

For spider webs and similar insect nest (not so much for dirt daubers), one can sometimes singe the nest out of the plenum and burner tubes of lanterns/stoves using a propane torch. Directing the flame heat thru the air passages can burn the silk/paper material away. With lantern burner tubes, the heat can be directed thru the burner screens, being careful to not to over heat the screens and damage them.
renaissanceman
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Re: 502 Generator spring removal

#24

Post by renaissanceman »

I've already had that rite of passage clearing an extensive leafcutter bee creation from the tube. All I did was use a bit of welding rod to break it up and dump it out.
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