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Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:26 pm
by BillHoo
I know performance can vary by each model of stove, but I was wondering what thoughts and obervances folks have had from mixing various fuels and running them throught their stove(s)?

I hear for cleaning, a mix of acetone and Coleman Fuel works well.

Some folks seem to like mixing a blend of kerosene and unleaded gas to run thru dual-fuel models.

Is Diesel the same as kerosene?

I've just run carb cleaner thru my 400b as a fuel and it seems to have a nice bright blue burn. Do you think there is added benefit of cleaning the insides as it burns?

I hear automotive fuel-line de-icer runs hotter in car engines. I was thinking of mixing with White gas to help burn off gunk at the jets. Or to run a hotter stove for faster boil-time.

How about mixing in some fuel injector cleaner?

Any thoughts? Favorite fuel mixes and ratios?

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:44 pm
by JimL
>>Any thoughts?

Yes. Are you trolling us?

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:50 pm
by BillHoo
"trolling"? Not sure what you mean?

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:56 pm
by BSAGuy
My mix ratio is 1:1 Coleman fuel to Coleman fuel.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 6:08 pm
by bridd
Nothing burns cleaner than good clean Coleman Fuel (or Crown fuel if you want to go cheaper).

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:06 pm
by Whitegas Extraordinaire
BillHoo wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:26 pm I know performance can vary by each model of stove, but I was wondering what thoughts and obervances folks have had from mixing various fuels and running them throught their stove(s)?

I hear for cleaning, a mix of acetone and Coleman Fuel works well.

Some folks seem to like mixing a blend of kerosene and unleaded gas to run thru dual-fuel models.

Is Diesel the same as kerosene?

I've just run carb cleaner thru my 400b as a fuel and it seems to have a nice bright blue burn. Do you think there is added benefit of cleaning the insides as it burns?

I hear automotive fuel-line de-icer runs hotter in car engines. I was thinking of mixing with White gas to help burn off gunk at the jets. Or to run a hotter stove for faster boil-time.

How about mixing in some fuel injector cleaner?

Any thoughts? Favorite fuel mixes and ratios?
Early on in my GPA addiction I was known to mix fuels, lacquer thinner, various paint thinners and solvents. As long as I cut it with enough CF it ran fine. Now I only use CF or Kero.

Fuel mixing

Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:49 pm
by Stovie
I'm a card carrying member of the Club when it comes to certain "snake oils" in vintage gasoline engines. Some of them work really well for their intended purpose.

But a gasoline fired stove or lantern is not a gasoline engine, additives just aren't necessary or even desired. Coleman fuel is just about as clean burning as it can get. I've heard some people claim success with certain additives when using automotive gasoline when no alternative is available. Maybe. But I'm a little skeptical of that.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:53 pm
by Phredd
The only mix i use is 80% kero and 20% coleman fuel for my kero lanterns and i do that mostly due to the fact that CF has antirust additives....

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2021 12:43 am
by BillHoo
Ok. Looks like the majority are on the pure Coleman Fuel or white gas camp for its clean burning properties.

I was just wondering, as I've seen some posts where folks talk of burning alternative fuels, or mixes for various situations or results.

I just recently got into camp stoves and such with a cheap isoobuutane stove off Amazon. I found those canisters come in various mixes of isobutane, butane and propane depending on what environment your camping in.

So, I was wondering if people do the same for liquid fuel stoves.?

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2021 6:11 am
by Gasman64
I didn't see Jet A mentioned in this thread yet, but if you can get it locally, it's better than kerosene.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2021 1:10 pm
by mnhogrider
You’ll see others recommend Seafoam in other places on the I net. I’m not a believer in using it in GPA’s. As mentioned, these aren’t gasoline engines. We pay more money for CF as it has less additives and keeps things running clean. Why would you add more additives?

If a lantern isn’t running prime, take it apart, clean it and run fresh CF. For what a can of Seafoam costs you can buy a gallon of CF.

Save Seafoam for your lawnmower. Even there I have my doubts.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2021 1:32 pm
by Pancholoco1911
My mix for Hipólito Amish converted lanterns is 80:20 ratio of diesel and rug. I’m in the experimental stage so I’ll report back until I run out of the 5 gallons already mixed.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2021 5:00 pm
by zoomkat
"Any thoughts?"

Yea, kind of part of the "voo-doo lantern cult".

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2021 7:07 pm
by BillHoo
mnhogrider wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 1:10 pm You’ll see others recommend Seafoam in other places on the I net. I’m not a believer in using it in GPA’s. As mentioned, these aren’t gasoline engines. We pay more money for CF as it has less additives and keeps things running clean. Why would you add more additives?

If a lantern isn’t running prime, take it apart, clean it and run fresh CF. For what a can of Seafoam costs you can buy a gallon of CF.

Save Seafoam for your lawnmower. Even there I have my doubts.
Do you mean Seafoam as a fuel line and jet cleaner soaking agent? Or Seafoam as a fuel additive to burn as a fuel and clean jets?

I do like how seafoam work on my lawnmower, and moped. I've even resolved some check engine lights in my car with it. Though I will not use it as an automotive fuel additive anymore since I heard it burns up the catalytic converter.

In the last days of my 2000 Nissan Altima, I had used Seafoam once or twice a year. Then in 2016 with about 300,000 miles on the car it failed emissions. Local mechanic could not resolve it. Went to dealer and paid them $400 to resolve it and get it inspected. Got the car back with emissions ssticker good for another two years. But then as I rolled out the lot, the Check Engine light came back on. they told me "Must be a loose sensor don't worry about it."

At that point the car was getting wonky. 2017 it failed safety because the catalytic convertor was hanging by a shred of metal. I removed the convertor to weld up the holes in it and found 80 percent of the insides had crumbled away. Welded up the holes so the pipe no longer hung loose and got it inspected and good to go for another year. At that point the AC no longer worked and I just got a new car!

From that point, I stopped using Seafoam. Maybe I coulda got another 60K miles if I did not uuse seafoam?

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:25 am
by Kay-Mo
Gasman64 wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 6:11 am I didn't see Jet A mentioned in this thread yet, but if you can get it locally, it's better than kerosene.
And RP-1 is Jet A that has an advanced degree! :lol:

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:08 am
by Gasman64
Kay-Mo wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:25 am
Gasman64 wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 6:11 am I didn't see Jet A mentioned in this thread yet, but if you can get it locally, it's better than kerosene.
And RP-1 is Jet A that has an advanced degree! :lol:
What's the availability of it compared to Jet A?
I'm less than half an hour from an airport, however, all my Jet A so far has come from a friend who just gives it to me at a yearly collector's gathering.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 6:07 am
by gootsch
I have a dozen lanterns of various ages at my Camp. Some have been there over 30 years, some only a few. It is a pain to truly drain and dry them to really get all the water that may be in them out as the is no electricity to run a compressor. So every couple of years I drain what I can out of all of the lanterns into an empty fuel can, I add a 12 ounce container of dry gas from a red bottle ( isopropyl alcohol comes in red containers, methanol comes in yellow containers ) and add clean fresh CF to fill the fuel can. This gives me about a 10% alcohol to 90% CF mixture. I then refill the fleet of lanterns with this mixture. It burns just fine and I no longer worry about trapped water in the founts.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:29 am
by Kay-Mo
Gasman64 wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:08 am
Kay-Mo wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:25 am
Gasman64 wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 6:11 am I didn't see Jet A mentioned in this thread yet, but if you can get it locally, it's better than kerosene.
And RP-1 is Jet A that has an advanced degree! :lol:
What's the availability of it compared to Jet A?
I'm less than half an hour from an airport, however, all my Jet A so far has come from a friend who just gives it to me at a yearly collector's gathering.
:D RP-1 is short for "Rocket Propellant - 1", and it's used in the Saturn V first stage engines and several other liquid fueled heavy-lift rocket boosters. So its available is essentially zero, unless you have friends who work at Cape Canaveral! RP-1 is kerosene with an ultra-low sulfur content and is refined to severely restrict alkenes and aromatic components that can cause problems with long-term storage. RP-2 has even less sulfur. Either would be great for Coleman Kero appliances! (if we could get it!)

Jet A should also be good stuff for our kerosene appliances as long as it doesn't contain "PRIST", an anti-icing additive. The glycol ethers in PRIST might generate some nasty fumes if used in a kero heater. PRIST has to be added to Jet A as it is loaded into an aircraft fuel tank, so it is unlikely that any Jet A that we would get would contain it, unless the fuel had been drained from an aircraft fuel tank.

As to Coleman fuel additives in general - remember that the fuel is basically boiling in the generator to produce vapor, and any additive with a different boiling point has the potential to leave deposits in the generator. CF/white gas is a relatively pure petroleum naphtha and doesn't leave much in the way of deposits.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 2:09 am
by JimL
Prist is a particular brand of the anti-icing agent, so one should keep that in mind when asking about fuel.

As far as it being added when the aircraft fuel tank is filled, not necessarily. I was offered all the jet fuel I wanted from a regional airport, but the airport manager advised me that it had the toxic anti-icing agent in it. In this case, the airport had the fuel delivered with the anti-icing agent already in it. It was a smaller regional airport and he didn't want the liability of someone calculating the amount needed and adding it when filling the aircraft. I did get some with the anti-icing agent, but only ran it in lanterns at a distance.

The stuff I'm occasionally able to get is drained from the tanks, but these particular jets have the compressors for the hydraulics in the fuel tanks which keep the fuel plenty warm, so anti-icing agents are not needed.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:54 am
by Gasman64
Kay-Mo wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 1:29 am
Gasman64 wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:08 am
Kay-Mo wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:25 am
Gasman64 wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 6:11 am I didn't see Jet A mentioned in this thread yet, but if you can get it locally, it's better than kerosene.
And RP-1 is Jet A that has an advanced degree! :lol:
What's the availability of it compared to Jet A?
I'm less than half an hour from an airport, however, all my Jet A so far has come from a friend who just gives it to me at a yearly collector's gathering.
:D RP-1 is short for "Rocket Propellant - 1", and it's used in the Saturn V first stage engines and several other liquid fueled heavy-lift rocket boosters. So its available is essentially zero, unless you have friends who work at Cape Canaveral! RP-1 is kerosene with an ultra-low sulfur content and is refined to severely restrict alkenes and aromatic components that can cause problems with long-term storage. RP-2 has even less sulfur. Either would be great for Coleman Kero appliances! (if we could get it!)

Jet A should also be good stuff for our kerosene appliances as long as it doesn't contain "PRIST", an anti-icing additive. The glycol ethers in PRIST might generate some nasty fumes if used in a kero heater. PRIST has to be added to Jet A as it is loaded into an aircraft fuel tank, so it is unlikely that any Jet A that we would get would contain it, unless the fuel had been drained from an aircraft fuel tank.

As to Coleman fuel additives in general - remember that the fuel is basically boiling in the generator to produce vapor, and any additive with a different boiling point has the potential to leave deposits in the generator. CF/white gas is a relatively pure petroleum naphtha and doesn't leave much in the way of deposits.
Yep, I Googled RP-1.
Yes, I know all about Jet A; been using it for years, been on this forum 11+ years, know all about how generators work, etc.
I get it from the same source JimL does, and know what he does (we both personally know the guy who gets the Jet A for us, who is the same guy that services the jet that uses it.)

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:28 pm
by Chucker
If it burns, it burns. If it doesn't burn - you won't try that again.

All alcohol will draw some moisture so if you add it to a steel fount or tank, you will get rust eventually.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:11 pm
by Phredd
So what's the dif between RP-1 and JetA?

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:10 pm
by Gasman64
Phredd wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:11 pm So what's the dif between RP-1 and JetA?
Even though RP-1 would be even better than Jet A, RP-1 is not available to the public. As far as some technical details, Kay-Mo described them earlier in this thread.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:14 pm
by thezman
Hey Steve, do you have a place that sells Jet A to the public.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:33 pm
by Pancholoco1911
thezman wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:14 pm Hey Steve, do you have a place that sells Jet A to the public.
Try your municipal airport. Mine sells but since Covid they are closed

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:52 pm
by Gasman64
thezman wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 5:14 pm Hey Steve, do you have a place that sells Jet A to the public.
To be honest, Larry, I do not know at the present time; I do want to check at Lancaster Airport. So far, all mine has come from a friend at a gathering.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 12:58 am
by thezman
Thanks Steve, I'll just stick with clear kero for now.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:31 am
by arizonacamper
Might want to check and see if diesel fuel is actual diesel fuel. Out here in Tucson and Phoenix jet a is used as diesel fuel. It's less polluting (cleaner burning) than traditional diesel fuel.
Shawn

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:05 pm
by burnt bacon
I'm using small amounts of Seafoam for the first tank of new fettles for purposes of cleaning up the system a little bit. I assume it does that, but it's impossible to verify.

Re: Fuel mixing thoughts

Posted: Sun Nov 28, 2021 2:36 am
by MYN927
With the amount of refinements done for kerosene-type fuel in the form of RP-1, I'd say its pretty much, the 'pound-for-pound' equivalent of Coleman Fuel or Crown as compared to regular gasoline(with or without additives), as far as GPAs / non-internal combustion engines are concerned.
For those who are already using CF or Crown, consider yourselves fortunate to be virtually at the 'Aerospace' level for GPA-users.