Picked up a Sears 743-42

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czechphotoguy
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Picked up a Sears 743-42

#1

Post by czechphotoguy »

So as I put in the title I was able to acquire a very nice Sears version 743-42 Lantern off of FleaBay for a pretty good price. I will post photos on here as I figure out how, so you can see it.

The vent is in very good condition.

I don’t know at all where the date code is as the bottom seems to be devoid of the proper labels because of another issue I will explain below.

My first question is where do I go to find a parts diagram as I don’t see that there is one on OCP’s website.

Amazingly so far as I have carefully worked step by step and taken photos also, this thing has come apart quite easily. I plan on bathing many of the steel parts in Evapo-Rust, and then dropping the brass parts in the vinegar/baking soda mix, and cleaning everything up.

The only issue that is already going to be a sticking point is the bottom of the fount seems to have been brazed. Now I don’t personally have any issue with that as I owned a welding/machine shop years ago and feel that the job they did can be “mended”, and repaired.

I haven’t ever see a pump like it before as it looks like it was built to power burner tubes and mantles 4 times their size. I haven’t dove into that yet (and I don’t plan on until I find out some more info about it) as it looks to be a 1” nut that is holding it into the fount.

Lastly, it doesn’t have the original Mica so I will have to search for that but all the rest of the unit is in very good condition and is all there and in good enough condition to be completely restored.

Thanks much,
Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#2

Post by Tgarner01 »

Does your lantern look like this one?

Image
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#3

Post by czechphotoguy »

Yep! That is the one!

The vent looks almost exactly as nice as what yours has.

So tell me is the original top nut black? Because the one that came with this is and I have lightly brushed it with a brass brush and the black isn’t coming off like baked on carbon deposits.

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#4

Post by Tgarner01 »

Ross I'm thinking these are supposed to have the looped top nut... Not sure why my photo has the one on it 😁 anyhow they were brass. I'm assuming yours has some built up carbon deposits like you mentioned. A soak in lye water or oven cleaner should clean it up. Wear the appropriate protective gear of course.

Just an FYI. These were built by Prentiss Wabers for Sears in the mid 30's. Very well built lanterns. Here's a photo of the pump tube removed showing the NRV.

Image
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#5

Post by czechphotoguy »

Well that answers the reason I won’t see a parts chart on the OCP page.

I guess my first question is where would I get the gasket for the 3 piece filler cap?

Is the valve packing the same as what you can get from OCP? It turns smooth but I don’t know how much travel there is so I have bottomed it out lightly in both directions (wide open and closed up)

Honestly I don’t really need to completely tear into this lantern just yet but I have started cleaning up the parts that have come off easy enough.

I want to make sure I don’t screw anything up, and while I do want to tear this down to it’s bare whatever. Like I said I’m not in a rush to get it fired up…yet.

I am wondering what I should put in it as far as liquid I’m not going to burn, and see if it actually leaks out the bottom after I oil the pump cup and decide to pressurize it?

I am soaking the pump in neatsfoot oil at the moment overnight to get it ready.

What is your best recommendation for a Lye product as I don’t have oven cleaner either?

I guess that is where I will end for the moment...

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#6

Post by Tgarner01 »

Ross, OCP carries your cap gasket.

https://www.oldcolemanparts.com/PW-Fill ... et-S9.html

Valve packing is much smaller than a Coleman. I would try yours first and snug it up if need be. It'll probably be fine. OCP's graphite tape also works good for the odd sizes.

I always recommend not pulling the valve from a PW lantern unless it's necessary. They can be tough to remove without spinning the bung. But they can be removed if necessary with a careful touch.

I personally would just put Coleman fuel in the fount if you're just wanting to check for leaks. Would be easy to drain and air out of need be.

If just cleaning small parts I would just find you some yellow can oven cleaner. I keep a lot of lye on hand for larger batches. Lye crystals can be bought in bulk on Amazon and eBay if you plan on some larger batches. Please search here for best mixing ratios and safety procedures.

Get it pressurized with fuel and check to see if the instant lighting circuit is working. If so there's a good chance it'll fire up.

Happy fettling!!
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#7

Post by Cottage_hill_bill »

Take a look at this thread https://www.colemancollectorsforum.com/ ... 75#p188075 before you tear into your PW. They are very different from a Coleman and some of the non-replaceable brass parts can be badly damaged if you don't understand how it works before you tear it apart. The example I show has a brass valve stem but most have a steel one and that is the weak spot of PWs. If the inner end of the valve stem is badly rusted it won't seal and you'll have problems getting the lantern to work properly. Otherwise they are extremely good lanterns.
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#8

Post by czechphotoguy »

OK so first off thanks for the help from everyone so far (and in the future) I appreciate it immensely.

I put 2 of the cap gaskets into the shopping cart as I am planning on picking up some other items for other lanterns already.

My two next questions are such…

Is there a generator that OCP carries that is the equivalent to what the one is in this lantern?

I pulled this one to check on it’s condition and the top needle was already bent, and I am concerned it isn’t going to properly fit back into the housing (I’m so not remembering specific names). This one is extremely covered in carbon and I don’t want to destroy the spring as I feel it’s going to take several quench and shock cool applications to remove it properly.

Plus I would just like to have a 2nd one on hand for such unforeseen situations.

What about the CV? Do you feel I should pull it, and examine it to see if it functions properly? Plus how do I make sure that it functions properly knowing it’s completely different from the Coleman versions?

Today I plan on cleaning all the parts that I put into both the Evapo-rust solution and vinegar to get them ready to put back into place.

The frame rest that is on this does need to be cleaned up but I don’t see any way of removing it from the lantern without removing a piece of the valve assembly. I do like the fact that the Sears “label” has two tabs on the back of it that can be pressed together in order to release it from the frame rest to be cleaned on it’s own, and then carefully put back in place.

From everything that I am already reading from you folks I’m very excited about this purchase because like I say it’s in very good condition (besides the brazing) considering all the parts came off quite easily.

It’s just making sure I don’t pull something off I don’t need too, and creating additional problems.

I have always stopped at points where I just say “no, wait for further assistance before creating further problems” when disassembling a new model of lantern I haven’t tackled.

From the make up of this lantern I don’t for-see that I can’t get this running fairly soon. It does need some extra cleaning by me to make it look just as good as the above photo provided.

Thanks again and I will await further assistance.

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#9

Post by Old Cat »

Ross, you done good. Nice lantern to find, and I’ll bet you get it polished up and running. Lots of good people with great advice on the forum to help get it going. BTW, In post#1, you mentioned “dropping brass parts into vinegar/baking soda mix”. You don’t want to mix the two. Vinegar soak first then follow with baking soda/water rinse to neutralize any acidic residue from the vinegar.

Good luck.
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#10

Post by czechphotoguy »

Oops…You are right. Not good to mix the two up as they will essential cancel each other out!

I will get photos up today of “Pieces” of the lantern, as I have been able to disassemble it pretty well. The next steps are cleaning things up and starting to address how to properly put it back together and eventually get it running.

Still hope to find out more info about the generator as that will be a sticking point considering I probably won’t be using the original one considering the above issue.

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#11

Post by Majicwrench »

It does not have a CV, it has a NRV. The CV is a "check valve" and isn't meant to be a perfect seal, like in a Coleman. The NRV is Non Return Valve, which mean no air returning past it. It is in Toby's excellent picture above, the small rubber plug in the brass holder is called a pip, and will need to be replaced almost always. Let's just say always.

Pictures. We want pictures!
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#12

Post by zoomkat »

"I want to make sure I don’t screw anything up, and while I do want to tear this down to it’s bare whatever. Like I said I’m not in a rush to get it fired up…yet."

Just be aware that taking a lantern apart "just because..." without any identified issue can often result in creating issues. Sounds like the bent generator pricker wire might be one. Note that the older Coleman generators often have a small piece of wire mesh in them that can damage the pricker wire if one is not aware of its possible presence.
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#13

Post by czechphotoguy »

OK…NRV.

“Non Return Valve” - got it!

OK so now where do I get the “pip”? I would imagine someone will send a link for me, and then I can go get one?

My other concern is how difficult will it be for me to take out the pump tube? Will I need any particular tools as I notice there is a “notch” below the nut that makes me thing there is a spanner wrench used to offset any torque I am going to place on the nut, or tube itself while taking it out?

Yes, yes, yes, photos will be coming soon!

:D

One last question…what typically does this model usually sell for when picking one up?

Reason I ask is I see several more on FleaBay and one is all beat to H E double hockey weapons, and the other is in relatively same condition as mine is, and they want like $700+. I am not planning at all to flip this as I’m going to clean, polish, braze, and eventually re-paint this baby to keep for my own collection so I can use it during camping trips, and start conversations with passerby’s.

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#14

Post by czechphotoguy »

zoomkat wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 5:18 pm "I want to make sure I don’t screw anything up, and while I do want to tear this down to it’s bare whatever. Like I said I’m not in a rush to get it fired up…yet."

Just be aware that taking a lantern apart "just because..." without any identified issue can often result in creating issues. Sounds like the bent generator pricker wire might be one. Note that the older Coleman generators often have a small piece of wire mesh in them that can damage the pricker wire if one is not aware of its possible presence.
Right…I was as careful as possible taking the generator apart as it had a very large amount of carbon all over it. The pricker came out extremely easy but as I pulled it clear of the spring, and generator assembly was when I noticed the bent end. I do believe that after I clean it I should be able to straighten it out. But this is the concern of making sure I have a 2nd (or even 3rd) one on hand “just because” things happen.

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#15

Post by Tgarner01 »

czechphotoguy wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 12:54 pm OK so first off thanks for the help from everyone so far (and in the future) I appreciate it immensely.

I put 2 of the cap gaskets into the shopping cart as I am planning on picking up some other items for other lanterns already.

My two next questions are such…

Is there a generator that OCP carries that is the equivalent to what the one is in this lantern?

I pulled this one to check on it’s condition and the top needle was already bent, and I am concerned it isn’t going to properly fit back into the housing (I’m so not remembering specific names). This one is extremely covered in carbon and I don’t want to destroy the spring as I feel it’s going to take several quench and shock cool applications to remove it properly.

Plus I would just like to have a 2nd one on hand for such unforeseen situations.

What about the CV? Do you feel I should pull it, and examine it to see if it functions properly? Plus how do I make sure that it functions properly knowing it’s completely different from the Coleman versions?

Today I plan on cleaning all the parts that I put into both the Evapo-rust solution and vinegar to get them ready to put back into place.

The frame rest that is on this does need to be cleaned up but I don’t see any way of removing it from the lantern without removing a piece of the valve assembly. I do like the fact that the Sears “label” has two tabs on the back of it that can be pressed together in order to release it from the frame rest to be cleaned on it’s own, and then carefully put back in place.

From everything that I am already reading from you folks I’m very excited about this purchase because like I say it’s in very good condition (besides the brazing) considering all the parts came off quite easily.

It’s just making sure I don’t pull something off I don’t need too, and creating additional problems.

I have always stopped at points where I just say “no, wait for further assistance before creating further problems” when disassembling a new model of lantern I haven’t tackled.

From the make up of this lantern I don’t for-see that I can’t get this running fairly soon. It does need some extra cleaning by me to make it look just as good as the above photo provided.

Thanks again and I will await further assistance.

Ross
Ross I use Coleman 220 gens in mine. They're nearly identical to the original PW gens

On the check valve/NRV it would really surprise me if the pip doesn't need replaced, but it wouldn't hurt anything to try it as is. These are not fuel submerged so only air can leak by.

You're doing good asking questions on a new to you item. Parts are not as common as Coleman, but not impossible to find either.. I've acquired quite a collection of PW GPA's over the past year and I must say they are every bit as good if not better runners than any of my Coleman. You will enjoy it no doubt 👍
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#16

Post by czechphotoguy »

Tgarner01 wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 7:26 pm
Ross I use Coleman 220 gens in mine. They're nearly identical to the original PW gens

On the check valve/NRV it would really surprise me if the pip doesn't need replaced, but it wouldn't hurt anything to try it as is. These are not fuel submerged so only air can leak by.

You're doing good asking questions on a new to you item. Parts are not as common as Coleman, but not impossible to find either.. I've acquired quite a collection of PW GPA's over the past year and I must say they are every bit as good if not better runners than any of my Coleman. You will enjoy it no doubt 👍
Good I was thinking they we’re pretty close to the ones that are in this lantern plus is seems like when I pick up a new batch of lanterns I get about 2-3 new generators for 220’s that I have plenty of now.

Can’t have enough brand new generators. Now I just need more for my 200a’s as I can’t get the springs out of them and then replace the paper elements!

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#17

Post by czechphotoguy »

Wow that was easier than I thought…

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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#18

Post by czechphotoguy »

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OK so sorry I didn’t have photos of it before I pulled it apart. I still have to clean the brass parts, but most of the steel parts are cleaned up (except the globe frame).

So as you can see I am very happy in the condition of it and it won’t take much to clean this up and hopefully get it running.

I just can’t take off the frame rest without disassembling the valve unless there is some trick as I do need to clean up the frame rest also?

Ross
Last edited by czechphotoguy on Fri Sep 16, 2022 12:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#19

Post by Tgarner01 »

Looking good so far!
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#20

Post by Majicwrench »

Do you really need to remove frame rest?

Pictures of the bottom??
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#21

Post by czechphotoguy »

Majicwrench wrote: Fri Sep 16, 2022 1:59 am Do you really need to remove frame rest?

Pictures of the bottom??
I would really like to clean it up a lot more.

Here are pictures of the bottom of the fount. This is the primary issue I have to deal with first before I start with other portions of the lantern.

Ross

BTW…I think I have found a “1” on the bottom but I am wondering for those of you that know how will I know a date on this unit, and how is it arranged?

Year Month
Month Year


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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#22

Post by czechphotoguy »

As a follow up to my above post. I have another question?

Is the bottom of the fount steel? Or is the whole thing steel?

If that is the case I have several ideas of how I can address this along with repair it, and it would take some of my TIG welding techniques. I have welded Chromoly, Aluminum, Titanium, Stainless within the bicycle industry when I built custom frames in Wisconsin (TREK) and Colorado (private frame builder and GT bikes when they we’re still decent and not made overseas).

I will await further instruction and help.

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#23

Post by zoomkat »

"Is the bottom of the fount steel? Or is the whole thing steel?"

Magnet...
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#24

Post by Tgarner01 »

Ross a magnet should tell the tale, but all my green founts with separate pump and filler cap are steel top and bottom. The earlier L13's were brass top and steel bottom. Same with the nickel variants made for Sears and MW. There have been others tig weld patches on their founts. A good fix. Might take a peak inside and look for how extensive the rust damage is.
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#25

Post by czechphotoguy »

Tgarner01 wrote: Sat Sep 17, 2022 12:23 am Ross a magnet should tell the tale, but all my green founts with separate pump and filler cap are steel top and bottom. The earlier L13's were brass top and steel bottom. Same with the nickel variants made for Sears and MW. There have been others tig weld patches on their founts. A good fix. Might take a peak inside and look for how extensive the rust damage is.
So can you tell anywhere from the photos a number at all designating what year this thing is? Granted I probably will find out after I do a paint strip of it figuring out what is what.

What years was this made and how did they designate date stamps?

Year on left or right? Month (the same)?

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#26

Post by Tgarner01 »

Ross no date stamps on PW made GPA's. Best you can do is find old ads that give dates they were available for purchase. Neil states in his PLC they were available from the Spring of 1936- Fall of 1941. Hope that helps.
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#27

Post by czechphotoguy »

OK technical follow up question because I completely didn’t notice this when I took the lantern apart even though I did take photos before doing so.

I see that there are two nuts that are the same size (I forgot what size that specifically is) but anyway.

One of them looks like it has “pressure relief” notches perpendicular to the threads, and the other does not. How are they arranged when placing them back in the correct places when I re-assemble this so I don’t get it incorrect?

I think that’s all I need as I am about to put the thing back together after I clean some more of the brass parts.

Ross
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Re: Picked up a Sears 743-42

#28

Post by Tgarner01 »

Ross the nut with the notches goes on the top side of the frame. This is the hold down nut for the frame to base rest. The notches clear the gen nut so it can be assembled with the frame off.
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